From: owner-monkey@valinor.eldar.org (Monkey Digest) To: monkey-digest@valinor.eldar.org Subject: Monkey Digest V1 #46 Reply-To: monkey@valinor.eldar.org Sender: owner-monkey@valinor.eldar.org Errors-To: owner-monkey@valinor.eldar.org Precedence: bulk Monkey Digest Monday, June 30 1997 Volume 01 : Number 046 In this issue: [monkey] ICQ [monkey] evil -monkey definitely mentioned here! Re: [monkey] Re: Monkey Digest V1 #43 ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Mon, 30 Jun 1997 13:11:59 -0700 From: Tu Chung Subject: [monkey] ICQ Does anyone here ICQ,I think that all us Monkey fans should meet up on ICQ and have a quiz or something. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 30 Jun 1997 13:10:09 +1000 From: "Clare O'Farrell" Subject: [monkey] evil -monkey definitely mentioned here! John says >Hmmm.. using long words as shorthand. Now that's a novel idea. ;-) I think this is a feature of technical language - using a technical word which serves as a shorthand for a whole paragraph or page of discussion. Saves lots of pages and repetition and useless bandwidth. :-) The only problem is nobody else understands what the hell you are talking about!!!! :-) >> What I meant is that one does not need to depend on anything else for what >> one is, that one says I'm me and do not need to relate to anyone or >> anything else for my existence - in fact I am a law unto myself and can do >> whatever I like. > >I see. I'm not sure I entirely agree, though. I think that's quite >a good attitude to have, to some degree. We don't want to end up >like in George Orwell's 1984. >Surely what you are saying is that the struggle for independence is, >in some way, evil...? Not at all - Independence and autonomy rule a okay - I am in no way advocating a George Orwell situation. All I am saying is that one has to recognise that one is a social being and interacts with others and that one cannot exist on one's own as separate from the rest of society and the universe - to try to do so usually leads to various kinds of destruction, not to mention insanity. But I am totally opposed to notions of rigid social conformity. Paradoxically the more one recognises how one is shaped by one's social and historical and social situation the more independent one can be from it and the more choice one has. One of the many reasons I like Monkey is because he is such an anarchist and so totally irreverant of social hierarchies. Just look at the way he acts in the presence of the Jade Emperor wanting to rip down the curtain and so on! (go for it!) Monkey is his own master (see his comments in the episode where he fights the 'good dog') but recognises (or at least learns to) that he exists in relation to others. Clare *********************************************************** Clare O'Farrell email:c.ofarrell@qut.edu.au web page: http://www.qut.edu.au/edu/cpol/foucault/ 'Let battle commence. Wine and.... bananas!' *********************************************************** ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 30 Jun 1997 14:24:47 +1000 (EST) From: Robert Walter Subject: Re: [monkey] Re: Monkey Digest V1 #43 On Fri, 27 Jun 1997, Aaron wrote: > > >I thought somebody might raise this objection - I am racking my brains how > >to get around it! Whenever I think of evil I think of something that > >deliberately destroys - the second part of my definition was also of > >primary importance in my definition It is the ultimate and illusory > >assertion of one's own difference and self sufficiency from the rest of the > >universe. On further reflection, integral to evil is the deliberate > >exercise of power for the sake of exercising power. If one wilfully > >destroys for no other end than to increase or demonstrate one's own power > >then that action is evil. Hence the kind of destruction involved in > >building a beach house is not evil unless one just wishes to destroy the > >worms and trees for the pure enjoyment of destroying them and proving that > >one is powerful. And of course the volcano is not evil as it has no intent > >(as far as I know!!) > > Nah....it's all relative. Many people would consider Hitler evil say. But > I'm sure that he would have felt that anyone that didn't support him was > evil. > > That is the reason that I don't beleive in evil or good. I think it is conceited for someone like me to say my beliefs (mainly pacifist) are any more valid than Hitler's (kill all the Jews etc.). I try to relate everything to myself and see what it makes me feel, instead of judging what others do. This is my only objection to the philosophy in monkey, it is too black and white. My philosophy blurs around the smudgy bits of real life, that's why I like it. For example, generally speaking I don't eat human flesh. However if I was stuck on a desert island and there was nothing else then I wouldn't hesitate to "dig in". Some people would object to this morally and therefore die, my logic is, "if I die, I hope they eat me, so if they die I hope I can eat them." If a person was absolutely aginst my eating them, then once again I'd have to oblige and die. That was an extremely chaotic and poorly written post, sorry. "Nothing worth saying was ever said in a signature." Robert Walter '97 ------------------------------ End of Monkey Digest V1 #46 *************************** ----------------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the Monkey Mailing List digest list, send mail to: majordomo@valinor.eldar.org with the following command in the body of your email message: unsubscribe monkey-digest To send a message to the list, send mail to: monkey-digest@valinor.eldar.org If you have any problems or questions, send mail to: owner-monkey@valinor.eldar.org For lots more information and news about "Monkey", check out the Monkey! web site: http://www.geocities.com/Tokyo/Towers/8153/